BIRD WILLIAMS: You're listening to Bird Means Business Episode 75.

Hello, hello, and thank you for tuning into Bird Means Business podcast. I am your host, Bird Williams. And today we have a very special guest Just Davia on the show. Let me tell you a little bit about my girl Davia. So she's a lifelong introvert who's managed to make an entire career around talking to people. Despite the introverted stereotypes, she comes alive when she gets to engage in meaningful conversations around racial equity, mental health, and well-being. Those passions inspired her to create multiple mental health and wellness platforms, like Redefine Enough, the Affirm podcast, the HUE project, and Reside Here. But the thing she's most proud of, she took a 12 months sabbatical that prioritized her own well-being. The sabbatical motivated her to build a business that helps other professionals breakthrough burnout and shame. I mean, yes, and yes. That is so motivating to hear myself. Y'all I first heard Davia speak at South by Southwest in Austin, and I left the session with my mind blown from everything she shared. So you're in for a real treat in this week's episode. We're going to get into a lot of the great topics around how to protect your mental health as an entrepreneur, especially in those early years, and how we can't slip into only identifying as a business owner. Because we're so much more. This conversation is intentionally timely as the month of May, is Mental Health Awareness Month. And mental health is a topic that's important to me, not only because of the stigmas associated with it, and the lack of education surrounding it. But because of my own mental health journey as well. Y'all I know I've shared on the podcast before, but I struggled with postpartum anxiety after having my first child back in 2016. And it really just hit me over the head unexpectedly. And I'll be honest. Before my own experience with acute mental health challenges, I had a pretty closed-minded view of what it actually was. I kind of just viewed it as depression. But anxiety was a very real thing for me, and I now can see how it really can affect our daily lives. So we're gonna have two guests from the mental health space on the show this month, to really help normalize the topic and equip us to be our best whole selves. 

And in that vein, before we jump into the episode, I want you to think for a second about whether or not you feel your business is equipped to be its best whole self. And what I mean by that is, do you think of your business holistically? Or do you really just focus on one aspect over another? So my signature business planning framework, which is called Prove It Plan, explores the four key pillars of your business: foundation, financial, operations, and marketing. And here's the thing. Those four pillars. They're not meant to be isolated as you build your business. You can't just focus on just the financial aspects or just the marketing or just the foundation. No. These four pillars work together to build a sustainable business. So in Prove It Plan, you'll strategically learn about and apply these four pillars of your business as you develop a powerful business plan. This is going to allow you to move forward with clarity and competence as you build your business. And enrollment is now open. So you can head on over to birdwilliams.com/proveitplan to learn more. I'll be sure to link that in the show notes, which is the episode description if you scroll down to read below this episode. Alright, let's jump in. 

Davia. I am so glad to have you on the show today. How's it going?

JUST DAVIA: I am feeling good today. Thank you for having me on the show. I'm excited.

BIRD: I know this is going to be such a treat. When I first met you, I was just floored by who you are as a person, what you were speaking about, like your whole vibe and just the power and presence you bring to spaces. So I am really truly honored to have you on the podcast, and to talk about what it means to be more than just an entrepreneur or more than just what you do. So we'll get into that in a bit. But I do want to highlight that it is Mental Health Awareness Month. And while I've woven mental health topics throughout many episodes on Bird Means Business podcast, because it's such an important topic to me. I also wanted to devote multiple episodes this month to the topic because I think it's so important for entrepreneurs with all we have to deal with and manage. That's something that we really need to lean into and be aware of. So to kind of just get started, I want you to give the listeners some background about who you are, and your entrepreneurial story. And to really just understand how you got into therapy and what that journey to entrepreneurship looked like for you.

DAVIA: Yes, it's really interesting, because ever since I was a kid, I never had like one job that I wanted to do. There were always many things. I'm like, I want to have a nonprofit. And then I also want to do this, and I want to do this. There were always a blend of career choices that I had. And the word entrepreneurship was foreign to me. But when I look back on it now, I very much always had that entrepreneurial spirit. And when I look back on my career and getting into therapy, it was because I was really steeped in the nonprofit world because I always came from this perspective, I want my work to make a difference. And I worked with kids for a major part of my career. I got in the school system, and I was working with this nonprofit, and we were doing this anti-violence drug curriculum. And I was like, y'all, babies need a lot more than this. That's what actually prompted me to go into therapy. And once I got into graduate school, I really started to expand my interest in what my career could look like, and just the different people that I wanted to reach. And once I got out of school, I was like, you know what? That little entrepreneur spirit was like, I can do counseling. AND here are all the 8 billion other things. And I essentially started building these platforms. And I had a podcast. And I was doing retreats on top of therapy, working at my nine to five agency job. And I got to a point where I was actually working at a domestic violence and sexual assault nonprofit. And so all of my clients were trauma clients. And needless to say, you know, hearing that topic, people are like, whoa, okay. You know, think about going to like networking functions. People are like, "Oh, that's what you do." 

So it's a heavy topic, and naturally, with that, it had an impact on me. And I decided, you know what? I love this work. But the environment that I'm in isn't good for me. And there's so many other things that I want to do. How about I give myself a chance to actually try it out on my own. And so I actually told my supervisor. I was like, "Saul, my lease is gonna end at the end of May. I'm not going to renew it. I'm not gonna live in Texas anymore. I'm just gonna go to D.C. and I'm gonna figure out what happens." I had no job lined up. I had no apartment lined up when I came to D.C..  Crashed with a friend and really just started my business. And it'll be three years. It'll be three years once this episode airs of me really just building my business and being able to reach a lot of people beyond the therapy office, and really diving headfirst into entrepreneurship.

BIRD: Wow, that is beautiful. I love it so much. And I really love that you just took the leap. Didn't have it all figured out exactly. Not even just like where you were going to ...

DAVIA: Not even just a little bit. 

BIRD: But you did it and then look at you now three years later. I just love it so much. So before we really jump into the mental health aspect of things, could you kind of tell us like if there's entrepreneurs who are listening, and they're kind of just getting started, or they're thinking about making that leap and starting their entrepreneurial journey. What do you wish you would have known then? Like, if you could go back and tell yourself, you know when you were just getting started some piece of advice, or a big lesson learned that you've had over the last three years, what would you share there?

DAVIA: You know what? So many things come to mind. And one of the things that I have to emphasize, whenever I share my story, I tell people, this is my story. This does not have to be your story. I think there is a lot of glamour with quitting your job and taking the leap. And I was like, maybe all y'all ain't meant for this life. Like we all have different expectations for our lifestyle. I am single. My friend loves to say, "You are unencumbered. Do the things that you desire right now." And I could be broke to build my dream. I'm like, I don't have kids I have to worry about. I can do all the things. And so with that mindset, I really think it's important for us to not compare our journeys to anyone else's. Because that is the hardest thing when you are first starting out to be in the thick of things and like, why am I failing? Like it's not going correctly? It's your journey. It's not going to look like anyone else's and allow it to be just what it is.

BIRD: Yes, I love that so much, because I completely agree. And I've talked about how when we launched The League, which is my gym business with my husband, back in 2013. I mean, we were single, young. We were like 24, 26. Whatever it was, you know. So we could do a lot more then than we could do now. We could not do that now with three kids. 

DAVIA: No, I think it would look very differently. 

BIRD: It would look extremely differently. And so, like you said, not comparing yourself. And not trying to say, okay, they're doing this. Well, then I'm gonna do it just like they're doing it. Because, again, you have different resources. Resources, time, money, energy. I love that so much. And just not comparing your chapter one to someone else's chapter five, or chapter twelve. 

DAVIA: People do that so much, and it's just not necessary. 

BIRD: I do that. I see these moguls. And I say, I want to do that. And I forget they have a huge team. They have a huge budget. 

DAVIA: All the things we don't have. 

BIRD: We're getting there, but I don't have those resources. So it's okay. It's gonna look a little bit different for me. So that is great advice. Now, what do you see, just to kind of go into the mental health lens, whether it's from your own experience, or just from other entrepreneurs you know, as some of the main mental health struggles that we face, like unique to entrepreneurs, as we're building our business? Do you have any thoughts there?

DAVIA: I have a lot of thoughts. One of the biggest things or misconceptions that I really want to clear up with entrepreneurs, is there is this thought that once you become an entrepreneur, you're gonna have all these mental health issues. Like you are just gonna be jacked up. And I'm like, okay, wait, pause. Flag on the play. One of the things that research actually shows beyond that idea is that some of the people have already been dealing with mental health concerns. And the reason we desire entrepreneurship is because it better suits us. It better suits our needs than a typical nine to five. So I want us to kind of challenge this idea or this fear that if I become an entrepreneur, I'm going to be plagued with mental health concerns. And the reality is, it may actually be a bit more accommodating to you, because you can establish what life can look like, because it's your business, it's your career. However, if we do not have healthy systems in place, then yes, our mental health will definitely suffer. Because there is stability with a nine to five that does not come with entrepreneurship. And the sheer anxiety about, "Will I be able to have my basic needs met?" is a very valid concern. And I think one topic that is not discussed enough, is trauma in entrepreneurship. Specifically, financial trauma. Like there are so many issues that we have around money because we need it to live. Like that's the basic part of it. But when you are struggling, you come from poverty, or something tragic happens in your business and you lose a lot of money. That affects your mental health. That affects your physical health. It also affects how you run your business. So one of the things that I would highly encourage anyone to do when you are going into entrepreneurship. Don't just think about your business plan. Don't just think about how much do I need to have in my savings. But also think about what type of support do I need to have, you know, emotionally and mentally? I was super broke. Once again, I came from a nonprofit background and girl was not popping like that, okay. But I came to D.C. And I was looking up sliding scale counseling centers. And I was paying five bucks a session so that I was not dealing with this transition on my own because it's hard to figure it all out. And regardless, if it's entrepreneurship, moving to a new city. When you are going through major life transitions, it takes an impact that takes a toll on you. So making sure you have the resources and the support to deal with that adjustment. It's really necessary.

BIRD: Ooh, that is so huge on so many levels when it comes to support. I can't tell you, Davia, how many times I've heard entrepreneurs say things like, "I'm just gonna do it all myself." "It's me." "I'm the CEO." "I'm gonna figure it out." I mean, I had someone book a strategy session recently who said they felt guilty about booking the session with me because they felt like they should figure it out. And it was hard because I was like, our session was actually on a specific thing that we wanted to focus on. But I was like, we need to dive into that. Why would you feel guilt about booking a strategy session? And, and I don't know if that's something that's unique. I don't know. I don't really know where that came from. Because I will outsource all the things. I have no shame. 

DAVIA: Right! Help me.

BIRD: Help me, please. 

DAVIA: I've heard that a lot from entrepreneurs. I recently did a series at a university and a lot of students struggle with this idea of this hustler mentality and being self-made. There is this pressure to be self-made, to have this title, and I have to do it all by myself. And part of me, I believe, it's rooted in our ego to feel affirmed that we did it by ourselves. But how much more stress are you willingly putting on your shoulders by not seeking support? And some of us have resources available to us. But either we don't want to because of ego. Or because we have previous issues with receiving help. It being used against us, or in not being helpful, and it actually causing us harm. These are all things that will be great to discuss with a clinician.

BIRD: Exactly. I actually have a client in that situation, too, who 1000s of followers on Instagram, very high profile influencer. And she's like, I was screwed over by an agent. And I'm not getting any legal help. I'm doing it all myself. And it took a few sessions for us to get her to, no for real, you have to have somebody who's looking at these documents and negotiating these brand partnerships. You can't do it yourself. And I'm not even a legal adviser to be able to help you with that and give you some advice. You're right. It's not always ego. It could also just be trust. And to your point about not trying to be Mrs. CEO, or what is you say, a self-made CEO. I have a whole podcast episode called "How I Don't Do It All". Because I was asked so often, how do you do it all? How do you do it? And I'm like, I don't. I don't do it. I have a village. It's a whole village. I have two and a half children. You know, one's cooking right now. So it's like, I have my mom, that helps a ton. I have systems set up. I have a team. I have a lot of support. And I don't need to feel like I'm Superwoman and can do it all. You have to really lean into that. And so I think entrepreneurs have to be very intentional, especially if you're a solopreneur. And you don't have a business partner. I was actually just talking with Terry about that the other day because we have a lot going on with one of our businesses. And I was like, I don't know how I would do this without you. You know, I don't know how I would literally do it without you, for so many reasons. But we can tag team. And it's different when you have vested interests, the same vested interests, right? Because sometimes when it's just a purely business relationship, it can get tense. He's my husband and partner. So it's like, look. It's is all going to the same thing, you know. But, yeah. So if you don't have that, I think it's important to have someone in your life who you trust, respect, and love and who's for you, which is so important, who you can go to and say help hold me accountable. I'm going to call you on my bad days. Like, I think that's huge. But then to go even further, and what is highly recommended is to have, like you're saying, a clinician, a therapist, someone who can actually help you see yourself in that way.

DAVIA: Yeah, and one of the things that I always promote about therapy is the fact that it is a space that is not only just for us to figure out life options, right? It's not just to only process what's going on in our life. But number one, it is an unbiased space for you to exist in, where someone does not have stock in what decision you make. So I'm not trying to say, "Well, you know, you've hit this road, this tough space on the road. Just come back home, you know. You can try this another time." They're not going to try to force you one particular way. Because at the end of the day, the goal is to figure out what helps you be your best and what helps you be your healthiest, and not having to worry about somebody kind of bringing things back up to manipulate you one way or the other. And, you know, our family and friends, they don't have bad intentions for us. But sometimes their support isn't the most helpful. And having someone that is neutral and really just wants to see you shine is really impactful. But then even more importantly, therapy provides a space that when things do start to shift if your mental health does start to decline and you're not in the best space. You actually have a professional that is not going to be overwhelmed by what comes up for you; is not going to shame you for it; is not going to call you weak; is not going to stigmatize or dismiss what you're feeling and say, "Well, maybe you just need to to work harder." You're going to have someone that can partner with you on creating a plan that gets you back to your best.

BIRD: Yes. Yes and yes, on so many levels. I actually just booked an appointment with a therapist that a friend goes to. I tried one a few months ago, and she was great. But I needed something different. And so I'm excited to check this new therapist out. And my husband and I have been going to counseling, marriage counseling for like, a couple years now. And it has been exactly what you're saying, and unbiased space. I wanted to make sure that it was someone who didn't know us, didn't know our background, wasn't from our church, you know. Because we have counseling at our church, which is great. But it's like, no, I need an unbiased person so I can really be completely open. And it has been incredible. So for anyone out there, entrepreneurs listening and thinking about counseling, what would you say? Are there any tips? Like I know, for me, personally, as a black woman, having a black woman therapist was important to me. Are there any other tips that people should just think about when they're looking for someone?

DAVIA: Yeah, the biggest thing that I tell people, and it sounds a little funny, but treat your search for therapy, like dating. It is a process of finding the one. Just because they have certain qualifications does not mean that you click. It does not mean that they are the right fit. Similar to you. I like working with black women. But there are other factors, where I'm like, oh, okay, you incorporate this? I don't like that approach. Next. I'm also a difficult client because I am a therapist. But knowing, you know what you like. Because a lot of people. I'm not gonna say a lot. I've come across many people where they've met with one therapist, and they're like, "I didn't like them. So therapy's not for me." I'm like, baby, there's more therapists. It's so similar to dating. That's one date. That's not the reflection of the entire dating pool. That doesn't mean we just give up. You might take a break. That happens. But I would say, the best advice that I got, for my first time going to therapy. A professor told me give it three sessions. Your first date tends to be awkward. When you go on a first date, it tends to be a little awkward if you don't know how you feel about this person, and vice versa. So give it three sessions. If by the third session, you're still just ick. Then let it go. Restart your session. But if by the third session, you're starting to open up. You're feeling a bit more comfortable. Keep going. See what happens. See what unfolds. And there are some clinicians where they were great for the first six months, and they helped you through a stage that you needed. And now you need to advance and they're not helping you get there. We thank them for what they were able to provide, and we move on and start that process over with someone else. So kind of just having the mindset that it's not going to be just immediate, and that's okay. But also allowing that process to kind of shift and change over time. And more importantly, it's okay to tell your therapist if they did something kind of weird or offensive, or you don't want to talk about something. Like that's okay, too. 

BIRD: That is so helpful. Thank you. I love the idea of thinking about it like dating because I guess I kind of experienced that. And that's helpful to know. I love that approach. Thank you. 

DAVIA: It's okay to break up with them. Just don't actually date them in real life.

BIRD: So right! So let's talk about this idea of being more than what we do. And I wanted to talk with you about this because I know that as business owners, it's so easy to get caught up in all the things that we have going on. And our business can become a huge priority, like THE focal point. And we can kind of slip into identifying as our businesses or as just a business owner. And kind of forget that we're whole people. So what are your thoughts there?

DAVIA: Yes, I think it's totally normal. Especially when you're in the beginning stages of building a business to be hyper-focused on your business, your identity as an entrepreneur. Especially if this is something new. You kind of want to really just reside in this new identity for a while. And that's great. It can help you build your confidence as an entrepreneur. And at the same time, because like you said, we are whole humans. It's important to make sure that we're tapping into these other aspects of our identity because it is easy to lose ourselves when our worth is attached to whether or not this product does well, or if this service gets a positive review. Now we don't know what to think of ourselves. Now we think we're losers. And when we're able to see ourselves outside of what we do, we give ourselves grace. We have other outlets. We have other ways to access joy and peace. And that's what actually allows us to kind of ride through those highs and lows of entrepreneurship. Because we have other parts of our life that are feeding us. And it's not all sink or swim based on our business.

BIRD: Yes, and I think that is especially important like you said in the beginning. Because unless you come into your business with a huge following, or tons of resources, like money, or even time or energy to be able to put into marketing. I mean, it feels like crickets a lot of times, right? It's like, you put so much effort into a product or a marketing campaign, or whatever it might be. And you put it out there. You think this is exactly what people want. People might have even told you this is what they want. 

DAVIA: I have been there.

BIRD: Okay? And it's like crickets, you know? And you start to think, am I not smart? Am I not strong? Am I not being this or that? And it's really just that it's going to take some time to build. And I think if there's one thing that entrepreneurs need is consistency. It's the grit to be able to say, I'm going to keep showing up. I'm going to keep at what I'm looking to do long-term. Look at long-term vision. Of course, it doesn't mean that you don't take breaks, or you don't pause if you need to. That is so key. But that you're going to say I'm going to get back up and try again, right? Because in the beginning, it can look a lot more rough. You're actually making more ground than you think. You just have to start somewhere. And I tell people a lot. Like, think about it. Let's say it's gonna take two years for you to really reach the level that you want your business to be at. Well, if you start today, you'll be there in two years. If you wait six months or push it off another year, it's inevitable that it's gonna take the two years. Like, it just takes a lot of hard work and consistency. So we can't begin to say, there's something wrong with me. I'm not good enough. I can't do this. We have to just say this as a part of the process.

DAVIA: Yes. And you not to even I had on that. We need an identity outside of what we do. Yes. What I do is important to me, because it aligns with my values, right? Like that is important for me to be of service. That is important. And at the same time, there is something really valuable about having realistic expectations, in the work, in the fields that we work in. Because often, I hear very ...  I'm trying to say this in a nice way. It's your first year. In your first year, you expect to get $5 million? What baby, huh? I don't know how we got here. like you haven't made 10 grand yet. And it's not to say that it's impossible, that you can't earn a lot of money or you can't, you know, reach these goals. But I think sometimes we are, once again, going back to this comparison. And saying this person did x, y, z. So that's my marker for what I should, a judgmental term, I should accomplish. And some of these things aren't realistic. They're not realistic. And because they're not realistic, we're not reaching them. And then we get caught in that shame loop of "I'm not doing enough. I'm not good enough. Maybe this isn't for me." And the reality is, we're focused on the wrong things. We need to readjust and we need to actively figure out okay, what am I doing? Why am I doing it? How can I do it in a sustainable way?

BIRD: Yes, yes, and yes, I could not agree more. Whoo, I'm getting all the conviction.

DAVIA: It's like, okay, you became an overnight sensation. But now you don't have any systems to actually get all these orders out and you're stressed and you're breaking down. Like that's not good. You got the numbers? Can you sustain it? 

BIRD: And I talk about that a lot even just with thinking about your business as a whole on the different inputs, I call them pillars. Marketing is one. And marketing is the one that everyone wants to focus on. Because it's the logo, it's the branding. It's the fun, cute, sexy, stuff. It makes you feel excited, right? But let's say you have all this great branding, and all this great marketing, and great social media, websites like just set. And you get all these people to come to your business. Your business triples overnight, and your operations are crap. And the money doesn't really make sense. And the numbers are off. And the foundation isn't strong. You don't really know why you're doing what you're doing, or have a team in place. Or even have an idea of what that team could look like as you scale. What happens? Bad reviews. Bad experience, right? So you have to think about it even as we're talking about thinking of yourself as a whole person. Think of your business as a whole business. It's not just marketing. That's not all business is. So anyway, just love that you brought that up. That's a good one. 

Now I want to talk about this more specifically with what you're doing. And I'm so excited to be able to share this. I'm not going to spill the beans. I'm gonna let you talk about it. But just like we're talking about you being more than an entrepreneur. Let's talk about the "More Than A Therapist" journal. 

DAVIA: Thank you! I love this. I love this little segue.

One of the things that I have been struggling with for the past few years if I'm being honest. I always dealt with a lot of guilt around wanting to do things beyond therapy. If it was in direct alignment with client-centered work if it was directly wellness-related. I'm like, okay, those are things that are approved. Those are acceptable in this clinical world, especially coming from the nonprofit world. And then I would feel guilty charging people. I'm like, I'm not allowed to do that. I work at a nonprofit. Our services are free. And so I would really hold myself back from doing anything that was just not super client-focused, that wasn't free. And these past few years, and if we're being honest, for those of you who do not know. I hired Ashley, last year. And I'm someone who has all these ideas. And I tend to talk myself out of them. But one of the things that I really wanted to do for therapists, because mental health is always a topic, and especially during May. But we tend to focus on the general public, our clients. And I'm like, but what about us? We have mental health too. Who is talking about our needs as we hold space for other people? And I decided to start creating services for therapists where I'm like, "You are more than just a therapist. You are more than what you do. How you serve and support others. What about your well-being? What about your life aspirations?" And I decided to actually fuse the two. And I created a journal called the "More Than A Therapist, One Year Journal", which basically has weekly check-in, where it's about figuring out okay, what are the highs and lows that are coming up for me as a therapist? How am I taking care of myself? And what do I need as a person? Because regardless of if you're a therapist, an entrepreneur, a parent. We have all these different roles. And sometimes we really just need somebody to ask us the question, "What do I need as a person?" That is what I do but as a person. So I wanted to create something for the helpers, or the people that are literally dedicating their careers to supporting others and making sure that they don't lose themselves. So I am launching that on May 11. I am super duper excited about it. I definitely almost talked myself out of it. Kudos to Ashley for "You're doing it this year." We're gonna talk about it.

BIRD: Yes!

DAVIA: It's happening. So I'm super excited to just be able to provide something that says, I see you and how you feel matters too. 

BIRD: Ooh. That is so good. I mean, I remember when we first started talking about this last year, 2020. All that 2020 was. I remember thinking about that for therapists because I actually went to go book, a therapist, find a therapist, and it was so hard to find a therapist. They were just being booked out. And there was a young lady I really wanted to work with and she just didn't have any availability. And I started to think, man, I wonder what it's like for therapists right now. Like we're all needing help, are they getting help? When you brought this up, I thought that is just incredible. And it's so important. I have so many friends who are therapists, or in that space who we'll be sharing this journal with. I have seen it. And I literally sent Davia email that says, "I want to be a therapist so that I can get this journal."  Like it is so good and amazing and just inspiring on so many levels. So if you are a therapist listening to this episode, or if you know one. You definitely want to go to the link in the show notes. I'm gonna link it there. Or you can share it, purchase it, support Davia. Because she's put so much work into it. And it is truly beautiful. So I'm really excited about it. Yeah, it is going to be a game-changer. 

So okay, this is a question I really like to ask guests. And this is the question. What is one thing that you're doing this week to be the best version of yourself? And I ask this question because we have these lofty goals and dreams which are all great. And I've tried to bring it down to like, what am I doing this week, this day, or whatever it is to get closer to that and make it really practical for people. 

DAVIA: First of all, I love that question. Let's just say that. Love it, love it, love it.

And you know what? One thing that I am proud of that I have been doing consistently. I've been listening to my body and giving myself permission to rest even if it's inconvenient. Even if that means I need to cancel something, I need to reschedule something. And a lot of times I give myself permission because I'm like, you have to practice what you preach. How am I going to be a wellness-centered business, Who does not prioritize my own? And so this week, I have been canceling things that need to be rescheduled. I'm like, this can wait. And truly listening to my body. When it's like, "No, BooBoo. You've been running on fumes today." And that has been a blessing. And I feel lighter because of it.

BIRD: That is good. And that's something that, especially with my pregnant body right now, that I need to probably do a better job of. Is really listening and cueing in. And it's so much just knowing what you need. But then, like you said, giving yourself permission, even when it's inconvenient. Even when I'm like, but I have to do this. I don't know if you shared it, someone shared something about, it was a mental health professional, about redefining what's urgent. Because I ascribe urgent to way too many things. Everything is urgent. My emails are urgent. And it's like, maybe no. My husband will tell me, "You made a bad deadline. Like you don't have to do that. You don't have a boss."

DAVIA: I literally had a conversation. I did a listening session with this company. And we were talking about racial trauma and grief. And someone asked the question, they're like, "But I have all these things that I have to do. How do we prioritize? How do we make it work?" And having to have that conversation and saying all of these things that we say we have to do? Do they actually need to be done? Are they actual emergencies? Or do we just feel this pressure to do them? Like really reassess what has to be done? Because a lot of times, like you said, they are self-imposed deadlines. Certainly, we are giving ourselves anxiety that is so unnecessary.

BIRD: And we see that creep into every area of life with what we're supposed to do and what we're supposed to be. I had a young lady reach out to me and say, I'm trying to conceive. I want to have a baby. But I need to know how to do it right. How to be a great mom. And I'm like, What is a great mom? Define it for me. I don't know. You know, motherhood looks so different for so many people. And there is no one way or right way. It's your situation and your baby. And really, you being good to yourself so that you can be good to your baby. So in the same way, it's like we put these self-imposed ideas on who we're supposed to be and what we're supposed to do, and how we're supposed to do things. So that is incredible that you brought that up.

DAVIA: I love the fact that you even brought up that example because even within one family, one parent is going to parent children differently based on that kid's needs. Every kid's needs are different. So you're gonna have to shift and adjust. And I think when we are so fixated on doing things one way, we can overwhelm ourselves because we need more flexibility. Because everything requires a little something different just like every day in business, with our relationships. Some flexibility is a gift.

BIRD: Oh, yes. And yes. Ah, this has been so good. I know that we could go on and on and on. But I know that there are so many great points that those who are listening are going to be able to glean from your wisdom and your experience. And I want to ask how my listeners can connect with you online so that I can link all of your information in the show notes as well.

DAVIA: Yes, you could find me online with Just Davia. It is everywhere. On Instagram on Twitter. Just Davia. And you can always check me out on my website, www.justdavia.com. If you are seeking mental health resources, because even though I am expanding beyond you know, one of my clinical services, I want to make sure that everyone has access. So if you want a guide to how do I find my therapist, where are directories? I have all of those resources on my website, because we all need that extra support, especially after the year we've dealt with, so.

BIRD: Yes, Lord. 

DAVIA: Like make sure you get it. Make sure you get it. 

BIRD: Thank you, Davia. This has been great.

DAVIA: My pleasure. Thanks for having me.

BIRD: Davia is just a gem like I said. I am so glad to have had her on the show. And I know you're wanting to connect with her now, too. So I'm gonna make sure to tag all the links that she mentioned in the show notes for easy access, including her brand new journal, "More Than A Therapist". And hey, you might not be a therapist yourself. But if you have a therapist friend. I promise you this is going to be something that they will want to get their hands on. And maybe you even gift it to them. So click the link in the show notes to check it out and to connect with Davia as well. 

And a quick reminder before we jump off. My friend, you are more than just your business. You aren't defined by its success. Yeah, you were great before any accolade or accomplishment, or profitable product launch or marketing strategy. So give yourself some grace as you go through this super messy process of entrepreneurship. You're doing the best you can with what you have. And as long as you continue to invest in yourself, you will grow over time in both your personal life and in your business. And just know I'll be over here rooting for you to win big. 

As always, thank you for tuning into Bird Means Business podcast. Make sure you subscribe on Apple Podcasts. And I would love for you to leave me a review. You can also follow the pod on Spotify. Be sure to tell every entrepreneur you know about this episode so that they can remember to see themselves as more than just an entrepreneur too.

Talk to y'all next week.